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As a working astrologer for the past twenty years, I work with two karmic houses, the 8th and the 12th and four houses of change or the opening for transformation which are the Cadent houses of 12, 3, 6 and 9.
8th house is the house of the Soul, planets here in this placement regardless of sign or interception carry soul karma with other people.
12th house is the house of Spirit, planets here in this placement regardless of sign or interception carry spirit karma with the divine or collective.
I have found that generally during and after the years that follow the Uranus opposition, or mid life crisis, that this is when spirit pierces the 12th house veil. Remember, Karma only comes when we expect it the least. Example: Say one was a wild child and did a lot of crazy things at 17, Spirit of the nature of the 12th house, to repay some past life karma will not ask you to repay. They will wait until your 51, settled, ice house and then all of a sudden the past starts coming up and opens a door, not only to the 17 year old, but the combination of your past life karma. Say if Saturn is there and you were an accountant for the Nazi Regime, which I feel is likely for souls being born now... 12th house karma is ten times worse than 8th house karma because it involves consciousness, separation for lifetimes, separation and undoing, addictions to anything like shopping to alcohol or the military etc.
To me, after this karma is paid, one gets the great spiritual advancement in soul terms, not money, human or praise terms. I think that is why its so hard, there is no reward in the mind body arena, but soul and spirit which is only about you.
Mary
8th house is the house of the Soul, planets here in this placement regardless of sign or interception carry soul karma with other people.
12th house is the house of Spirit, planets here in this placement regardless of sign or interception carry spirit karma with the divine or collective.
I have found that generally during and after the years that follow the Uranus opposition, or mid life crisis, that this is when spirit pierces the 12th house veil. Remember, Karma only comes when we expect it the least. Example: Say one was a wild child and did a lot of crazy things at 17, Spirit of the nature of the 12th house, to repay some past life karma will not ask you to repay. They will wait until your 51, settled, ice house and then all of a sudden the past starts coming up and opens a door, not only to the 17 year old, but the combination of your past life karma. Say if Saturn is there and you were an accountant for the Nazi Regime, which I feel is likely for souls being born now... 12th house karma is ten times worse than 8th house karma because it involves consciousness, separation for lifetimes, separation and undoing, addictions to anything like shopping to alcohol or the military etc.
To me, after this karma is paid, one gets the great spiritual advancement in soul terms, not money, human or praise terms. I think that is why its so hard, there is no reward in the mind body arena, but soul and spirit which is only about you.
Mary
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Thu, September 10, 2009 - 11:38 AMHi Shaman, just a technical question about karma. Would you say karma is always "bad" karma, or does it include "good" karma as well?
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Thu, September 10, 2009 - 1:37 PMShaman,
I have my Moon, Mars, Saturn and Pluto in the 12th house..all are in Libra. Does this mean that I have a big whoop full of karma to pay back? I always feel this vague disconnect, or inability to get to the bottom of this cavernous emotional side. I use to think that it had something to do with my Scorpio Rising/Aquarius Sun, but now more and more I'm starting to think its the concentration of planets in the 12th.
Many Thanks
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Thu, October 8, 2009 - 5:31 AMRexie, you need to get in touch with Scasco, he's in the metro area where you are located.
If you need anything close to the soul lessons I was forced to undergo, I pray for you. However, it clears out the karmic debt, BIGTIME. -
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Thu, October 8, 2009 - 4:26 PMHey friend hook me up with Scasco!! Remember we did choose to do our Karma all at once this life time with our 12th house planets , especially 12th house Pluto. We have only just begun to live!! ( and I thought we were old souls dammit!!)
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Mon, September 21, 2009 - 9:13 AM
The dwarf planets, Makemake and Ceres conjunct in Leo in my 12th house, and they trine dwarf planet, Eris retrograde in Aries in 8th
That's using whole sign house system
dwarf planet,Haumea is in Virgo in 12th house if using Placidus,Koch,Equal House system. It's in 1st if using whole sign house system. It's conjunct my Ascendant with 2'12 orb.
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Sun, October 11, 2009 - 10:13 PMI have
12th house Mercury, Venus, and Sun
and
8th house Mars and Saturn
I was wondering if you could tell me what kind of past life issues that could represent.
I seem to get into a lot of accidents and have a lot of people blame me for stuff I didn't do, but that might not have anything to do with it.
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Fri, November 13, 2009 - 6:34 PMHI Mary, I can't believe you said that. I just found this site I have my sun/mercury/pluto in the 12th.asc.leoin1st on cusp i think.I don't know alot about astrology but you works struck me to the bone.I would like to the think I get the gold ring after paying my debt. In the mean time it has been tough.Thanks for such truth
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Fri, November 13, 2009 - 9:46 PM12H Leo Pluto Sun combust and Virgo Jupiter conjunct Ascendent; 8H empty but for Ceres; 3H Scorpio Saturn square Pluto Sun combust; empty 6H & 9H ~ Not exactly my experience. I was paying back by my first Saturn return, and arguably before that. Only now at 53 do I feel as though I have some chance at liberation, but, of course, I have to have that secretly. But, at 53, I have plenty of practice keeping my liberations secret, so ~ cool.
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Re: 12th HOUSE KARMA TO THE COLLECTIVE
Sat, November 14, 2009 - 8:14 PMI don't know if I am understanding this correctly.
My moon is in the 12th house.
... *gulp* because I am so unusually meticulous... I know one thing I am going to have to pay for... I hope I have already paid for it... I think I have...
*gulp*
